Who knew this many people like music <laugh> I did. Because we find music wherever there are people, even the Praha tribe of the Brazilian rainforest, they have no words for numbers, no words for colors, yet they have a rich, beautiful musical heritage. And we've been making music for a long time. Um, musical instruments. We start finding 'em around 40,000 years ago. This is my favorite from 30,000 years ago because it's carved from the tusk of a wooly mammoth, a flute that could play, I think a complete diatonic scale, which shows real commitment to music making. Sorry, I'm late for the gig. I was chasing a mammoth <laugh>. And we keep making music to the present day where we are swimming, if not drowning in music, it would take more than one lifetime to listen to all of Spotify. I'm doing my best <laugh>. And as much as it's wrapped up in our history of the planet, it's wrapped up in the history of our own personal lives. From the rhythms of the womb to our first mother's song. Every birthday, every wedding, well, one or two, I dunno how many here <laugh> and even at the funeral, we can't escape music every day in between. We turn to it like a dear friend to console us in our darkest moments and elevate our brightest ones. How does this happen? Lucky for us, we've got a lot of music to choose from. Basically, the planet is one big unsupervised musical experiment. Plant some humans, spread 'em across the globe for hundreds of thousands of years and see what music we make. So let's go to one of the end of these branches, to the relatively isolated Solomon Islands, which is in the o oceanic, which largely untouched till about 200 years ago. And in 1969, uh, the musicologist Hugo Zemp came with a newfangled tape player and recorded, uh, a lady called aqua singing er a lullaby by, um, I'm gonna just play it to you. We'll play it, listen to a few verses, see what you make of it, and then we'll discuss it. I happen to find it really beautiful. More so when we translate the lyrics. There's only 6,000 people who speak this language, so you can't check if I'm wrong, <laugh>. Um, but it tells, it's a older sibling talking to a younger sibling, let's say a sister talking to a brother just after their parents have passed. And I'll try and get through it without crying. It's a low chance. And the older sister is saying, do not cry. Do not cry. I will carry you. Yes, our parents are dead, but they will watch over us in the house and all of the gardens, they will watch over us with this endless lullaby. Do not cry. I will carry you. I made it. Whew. But let's discuss why it was accessible or even beautiful to you. So what we find, we could have found any music at all, but what we find here is sort of grammatical structure. Two phrases that have been subdivided into parts. And you might also know, notice some repetition of rhythms and melodies, particularly this gorgeous dropping minus seventh. Love it. Um, we also get what's called a melodic arch, which is very common, if not universal, and a set of pictures. We didn't have to have that, but we have a set of unique pictures. These are a pentatonic scale, which you can mimic on the black keys of a piano. Um, but it's also adorned with these beautiful coloring notes, which imply a lidian dominant for any jazzes here. It's you. You would've heard it in the Simpsons theme. So this is the scale. And you hear that last one sounds stable. That didn't have to happen, but this is what happened in that piece of music. So in order for us to understand music and it's power, let's think about this, that melody for us to hear, it had to be passed down for generations and generations without notation or recording. It was only cradled by memories and air. So there must have been something in it that stuck. But we can't fully understand music without understanding sound. And I think sound is overlooked in its impact to the flashiest sight. Usually the analogy is that you're dropping a pebble into a pond and the waves ripple out and reach you, which is all beautiful and understandable. But sound is a three-dimensional wave that emanates and it hits you fast. My words are hitting you at that over a thousand kilometers an hour. And some of those wave fronts are this big. And the wave fronts themselves, they're not these big waves, they're pushing forward and backwards. But on the micro scale, I mean thousands of a width of a human hair hardly past its own diameter of the molecule. And yet we are here because it's surprised that evolution could not ignore. So a whole bodies and brains turn to it, this ability to see in the dark and behind objects. And so what you have is an ear might not be used here. And these aren't just for hanging off decorations, they're for funneling the sound and putting them into the inner ear where it hits the paper thin tympanic membrane or eardrum. And then through a series of levers of three smallest bones in the human body, hit the cochlear and translate that sound wave into an electrical wave. I'd say like a microphone, but a microphone is like an ear. Biology invented it first. So it's even possible to get up close and trap that electrical wave and play it back. Well, not for me, but for people like Nina Kraus of at her lab. And she kindly let me these samples. So what you'll hear is the sound going in and then the electrical wave, what they managed to retrieve the sound. But these sound waves are super powerful. They can hold all the music. You can imagine all the music that ever existed on this little wiggly wave. But what's odd about it is that sound waves as powerful as they are, are very weak and fragile. They disappear even in this great hall very quickly. So, um, most of the sounds of human history or the earth's history is gone from the dinosaurs to the Neanderthals, from Pythagoras to Paganini are lost forever until in the middle of the 19th century. This French guy, uh, you might not have heard of him because Edison was the famous person for capturing sound waves, but he was actually the first to do it. The re what he did was build this, um, contraption called the phone, autograph the sound writing device, and it basically mimicked the human ear. It's got a funnel, it's got a series of levers like the os in the, in the human ear. And then it wrote on a rotating hand rotated cylinder into soot, the sound wave. Here they are. Now, what's kind of sweet and tragic is that he had no idea how to play them back.<laugh> <laugh>. So he is largely been forgotten. But here they were the first recordings of sound. In fact, he didn't even think about the idea of of playing them back. He thought of 'em as just a photograph of sound. But in 2007, a team managed to convert these back to sound. So this is the recording, please work of the first of the earliest human voice. Now before we hear it, he's gonna sing. He's not a professional singer and is turning this crank into search for goodness sake. Also, he didn't think anyone would hear it again, <laugh>, not even himself. So it feels like a bit mean all of us listening in. But here we go. You got it <laugh>. But you impressed by, Okay, Wasn't me. But what I get, it's a real human connection to this person. And in fact, if you think about sound for that much of a history, sound was only local area. But now with, with this one moment, we have emancipated it from the local area from time and space. And I feel a real connection to this guy, especially when he's larking about with some comic opera. Ready,<laugh>. So sweet. Um, we have now a long domesticate the sound wave. We can describe it in sort of numbers. We can put it onto electromagnetic tape as ruraler lives. And we can even, we can even piggyback on radio waves. So it can go now at the speed of light and escape the air. So we can do things like taking, I take a child's voice, take that sound wave, hop it onto a radio frequency, bounce it against the moon, catch the reflection a few seconds later, which is what the sister moon project helped me do. My name is Chloe and I'm six and a half. My name is. And we've also wrapped it onto the voyager on golden disc. So it's now escaped our solar system so that maybe extra terrestrials can make sense of music and we can see if it's truly universal. So how do we make sense of sound? Okay, so this is what a sound wave looks like. It's got frequency, sorry, it's got time against amplitude. It's called an cylogram. It's a writing of how it oscillates. And so you can get a sense of its shape, of its volume. Um, but we don't really understand its content until, until we zoom in. If I stop it here, then you can see that's this is a tuning fork. But you can see that looks very much like a sine wave. It's a particular wave that zones in on one frequency. And inside our brains we have areas that are called tonotopic. They're a gradient of frequency sensitivity. So this is focusing on, on our 440 hertz. It's a wavelength about this big and you can hear it 'cause it's burning a hole in that area. Um, the wavelength determines the frequency in inverse and thus the pitch. So this is a better way of how better representation of how we actually listen. If we can think of this as time and frequency that way, then that note we heard is cutting across. We can put a piano there, but the piano is smooth in this case. So it's cutting across as an A. This is called a spectrogram and it shows the amplitude in terms of brightness. So you can see there's some other junk in there as well. Some dust of noise. And the where I hit click at the end and didn't forgot to edit it out, you can see it Of course sounds are more complicated than that. Can anyone guess what this sound is from the look of it? Any guesses? Oh, <laugh>. This one. We can tell it's a musical instrument or a musical pitched instrument 'cause of the harmonic regular steps between them. Harp harp, well it comes in. Harper has a stronger attack anyway, boy, is it, this isn't a quiz, what do I do? And this one. What starts with a click and then sounds like a terrible joke. And then the harmonics diminish. Nadia shouldn't that. Yes.<laugh> Piano. These are all the same notes, but they're shape of harmonics and above. It helps us determine what's what. So if we take something like that, if we hear something like that, we're doing a, a number of abstractions, we can suddenly hear that this is a female voice. We'll find out. We can also tell that there's a melody. We can also tell that there are, you see those changing shapes above it. These are different valves, the white nose of. And from that we can bring out musical elements like rhythm chain and pitch over time. And tambra, She, It is extraordinary that we can do this. It's extraordinary that we can do this more so that we can do it all at once. We can integrate and segregate all these sound objects. Let's see how good we are at it, at doing this. Oh, you might know this. Look at that and see if you can hear it. Sorry about the distorted sample. Let's see if you can hear the sound in it within it. Okay, try this one. You heard brainstorm anyone? They're the same sample. Uh, we're just on the edge of integrating. It's been, it's been manipulated. So it sounds just exactly halfway so we can be primed into what we hear.<silence> It is that dress all over again.<laugh>. The point is, is that listening is both bottom up. What comes to us and what we imagine it to be, how we, how we are primed to hear. And musicians exploit this so beautifully like Revelle, who orchestrates in such a way that instead of just using this big force of instruments, he collates them. In this example, he puts the, uh, woodwind above the rest of the orchestra but moves them in parallel rather than a musical diatonic motion. Why? Because that's how a church, organ, organ would sound. The harmonics would move together. And you can maybe see it here. And electronic musicians, this is their playgrounds 'cause they can basically use it as a canvas and write whatever they want to. Some sneaky musicians actually hide pictures in there. And Apex twin fans have learned to turn the sound waves into spectrograms to find these hidden messages. But we wouldn't do something so silly here, would we?<laugh> sounds like an eight bit grasshopper hopper<laugh>. Now sometimes music is called a language. And it's true that when we speak we have musical qualities, we have rhythm, we use intonation. You can tell if I'm angry by the monotone and clipped voicings. You can tell if I'm being con condescending. Can't. Yeah.<laugh>. So we seem to understand this. So let's try this out. Could you just say this word just naturally as possible? Good timing. Okay, let's try this one. Wait for me. Ready? The microphone Better. And let's try this one. Ready? This is a silver microphone. Whoa, that was good. Now you, this is what you did what most people do, which you had this descent for silver. Silver, this descent for microphone. But when you said the silver microphone, it was a melodic arch. As we saw in ela, you see how silver was reversed because, um, it's indicating that we're not at the end of the sentence. So let's try this one. Ready Micro. So weird sector and starts. Oh, you're very good. So you did it perfectly. Did you notice that? Are you gonna take it from there? Okay. Um, you'll notice that when we ask a yes no question, it goes up. And when we ask a wh question like who or why it tends to go down. How do we learn such strange things? We learn it as children. You, we do this naturally. When you talk to a child, we speak differently. So for example, if I talk to you, I say that's a microphone. But if I talk to a child, I would say that's a microphone. So we're teaching them the hidden music of language. And it seems that music spills that music of language spills into the language of music. So for example, French has, um, a more even distribution of rhythms and pictures in their neighboring phonemes. That was a good sentence and I got it through. So common vu, whilst English is more bouncy, how are you doing? Even I say it naturally. It has more, um, melodic contour and differences in rhythm. And this large scale study showed that was echoed in the music of, uh, English and French composers. And so musicians, unwittingly or not, are putting the music of language into their music are like this moment from Elga where he imitates the stutter and laughter of one of his friends in one of the variations here. And we have grammatical structure, question and answer. This is a famous example where we get that melodic arch but distributed between two instruments. But what people don't notice is that there is another hidden question and answer between the base and itself. We have two arches at once, conversations at the same time we also find sentence structures, for example, it's a common grammatical structure to say one thing, sort of elaborate on it, introduce some new material, and then come to some sort of conclusion like I just did. And we hear this, um, in, uh, music all through eras and styles. I could pay you thousands, but we'll go with this one. And the resolution again. Ready? So idea, variation, new idea And Conclusion seems so natural right Now. Let's look at the language of music. Yes.'cause in some ways music is not like all the languages. For example, there's an object which we call the moon and other languages have names for it, but it's still pointing to the same thing. There is no musical word, word for moon. I mean, you could turn the letters into a melody like some weirdo like me would do that or we could evoke the nature of the, the feeling of the moon. But there is no an ambiguous word for moon. So what is the language of music? Well, let's pick this apart with, um, an example from Bartok. Bartok was an incredible composer but also contributed much to ethnomusicology. He adored folk music and would travel lugging around the huge, um, Edison phonograph, which could record and play back capture literally nearly 10,000 pieces transcribing them. He cared so much about it and put it into his music. So he has a piece that he recorded. There's his field book with his record, his transcription and some notes about it. And here's his recording. So he transcribed this many times. Actually there's about five different transcriptions. Sometimes he went into great detail about the intonation and the rhythm changing tempo every bar, other time you've reduced it just to this elemental level. And in so doing, he's teaching us something that music has this sonic canvas moment, this one time performance with is all its detail, but it also has this geometric language, the essence of a melody. If we reduced it down, what is that thing that's the same, even if we play it in a different key or with a different instrument? What is that thing that is the same? So this is his, um, later composition around this melody. And you can see that he's taking that motif and spread it out and still retain the character. It's A tritone away, but it's completely recognizable. It's on a piano, not a voice. Dorian mode, by the way. So it seems that the language of music is these simple, likable, robust objects that can survive retelling and modification. Um, there must be a point where you distort a melody and it becomes something else. But in the right hands, a melody can be extraordinary. I'm gonna play you this example, which has comes from a anthology of Lithuanian melodies and see if you recognize it. Anyone recognize it? That's because Vinci had a copy of this book and you can hear these melodies throughout the rite of spring. In fact, I don't think he even heard the, or the original melody. So it shows the how notation is a good home for these geometric shapes. So here's his version of it. I wanna hear it all as well.<laugh> and the malleability is extraordinary. In the right hands. Take Gershwin's, I got rhythm variations where he takes a four note motif and with hardly anything else, creates this incredible introduction. He does extraordinary things to it. Not just transposing or stretching, but stretching the gaps between them. Turning upside down and backwards, stretching it so long that it becomes an accompaniment to itself. See how many that you can hear? Beautiful. So now this is why you are here.<laugh>. How on earth does this become motion sound, this decoding of sound and the um, its geometric shapes. It's true that music somehow makes our entire brains light. Up here is, um, data from someone listening to Astor Piazza. We'll listen to a little bit of it. It's lighting up regions for auditory control, motor control, memory prediction, visual of cortices as well. Why All these things. The reason is, is our brains are supremely complex, but their mission statement is really simple. And that is survive. That's it. It just wants you to survive. Well really your genes, but let's not be <laugh>. Um, so what is it about about that? The, the brain wants you to survive. And what it's doing is it's just, it's just bringing, it's encountering the world around it through its perceptual, uh, channels. So it it perceives the world and it brings it to the brain and it, what the brain wants to do is what to do. We see someone running towards us or something running towards us. What the brain wants to do is the right thing in that situation. And usually it's just a positive or negative thing. It's, is that a good thing to have? Is that something worth encountering or is it something that you need to run away from? And it does this with an extraordinary predictive mode. This, um, active inference that it does. And we'll give, we'll explore that much more in the next lecture. But really emotions, sorry to say, are just motivations to act. If we are scared, we'll freeze or run away. If we're angry, we might take a stance and attack. If we, if we're hurt, we won't do that again. So the brain is just taking in the outside world, trying to predict best what's happening and then releasing these emotions to make us act a certain way. Doesn't sound very romantic, does it? But music has an incredible set of trigger points in order to get to our emotional states. This is just Lynn's bre VMA model of some mechanisms which music uses to reach our emotional centers. They came up with this acronym of Bre fma. And it makes sense because it's the order that you get it when you are in your child's development. But let's face it's a horrible acronym, sorry. So I prefer ever beam because seems to fit music's poetry. So let me talk through them. Um, episodic memory is essentially a retrieval cue. If we've had a really deep emotional experience and we hear some music, they can become bonded. Thank you for all your nostalgia, um, responses in that survey. There are very moving. That's exactly what's happening. Like a smell. It connects a piece of music with an event that's important. Sometimes the piece of music doesn't matter, but sometimes it has meaning or we retroactively put meaning on it. And usually it's quite sad 'cause even if it's a happy memory, it's gone. But if grief is love with nowhere to go, perhaps music gives it a home. I cried then <laugh> perhaps music gives it some kind of home. And the only antidote is just to make more memories. I suggest final crackle always helps for some reason. Visual imagery is when sound evokes, uh, a visual image landscape, spacious skies. But it also evokes along with that programmatic evokes a sort of abstract world of turning and flying and dipping and diving. So Vaughn Williams, the Lark ascending seems to do both as a pastoral setting, but it takes us on a flight emotional contagion. Our survival value is to be able to recognize the emotion that someone else is feeling. This is useful when you're bonding with a child or out in the world with people who aren't so friendly. But we can hear that music, of course when someone is singing, we adapt to it. But an instrument seems to be a surrogate for a voice. In fact, we can even take an electronic tone, a sore tooth wave, filter it a little bit, put some reverbs and portamento and vibrato and we're suckers. We, we hear it as a Human voice. We wanna rhythmic entrainment comes from our need for communion, to work with others, to coordinate our own movement, but also in work activity. And when we hear rhythm, it taps into that thing and we feel a sense of communal gathering. Stop having fun. Okay, probably the most primal and the earliest mechanism is the brainstem reflex. And that's what's happening in our immediate environment. And it's usually scared. So it's a loud bang or a thunder or the absence of it. It's happy. So music taps into that mechanism as well. Another mechanism is evaluative conditioning. Like Pavlov's dogs, we are constantly linking positive and negative associations to the world. That's how we survive. But in music also, we do this in a really complex web and screen. And media writers know this really well. So for example, they will choose a upright piano over a grand piano to give a sense of homeliness. And the listener most of the time is completely unaware, but they're just brought along with these associations. We also get emotion about the music itself. That bark could write a six part hug or that six year old girl can play boss so beautifully. So we can be moved by things around the music. Um, for example, you might like Django Reinhart's music, but understanding that he was born in poverty and burnt his in a caravan fire, burnt his right leg and his left hand hideously. So he only had two fingers of his fretting hand, but he held those two fingers up to fate and became an absolute virtuoso. And so when you hear him play, you hear the sort of triumph alongside the music. Are you guys hearing everything? Okay, good. We can pump it up a bit. If you can't, if you don't, this is the final one. And I suppose it's a mechanism exclusive to music. It's the predictive, the predictive mechanism by which we understand where those geometric shapes are going. So if we set up a pattern and it gets met, we feel, feel a sense of reward. If it gets thwarted in some way, we might be confused or excited or curious about it. And I spend my whole life in this world. So I'm only allowed one example. So if you ever played on the piano and you've just missed a note, you'll realize the one really close to the one you intended is the worst one to hit <laugh>. And the reason is that the piano is not linear. For example, um, music tends to have a collection of tones that aren't next to each other on the piano. Let me provide some insight. So if we take this note here, it's a D but it could be any of them. Now what's the nearest note to that? D is probably all the other dss, right?'cause there's this octave equivalence almost universal. Um, but the next nearest one is upper fifth, which I've kept mentioning in this talk. So we can put that there. But because octaves are un uh, equivalent, we can also go a fifth down and place that one there. We do that again and what do we get? But the pentatonic scale of aurora gola, I like that noise. What if we carry on here? We get the diatonic scale of I know a little forest and countless other pieces. If we continue, of course we complete this cycle of fifths. So this cycle of fifths is a pentatonic scale extending to a diatonic and then this other hidden pentatonic scale on the other side. Interesting. And there's nothing special about those notes. You can rotate this and still create that structure. I like to think of it like a moon, moon again with the pentatonic scale and the diatonic scale in the light and this other mysterious hidden pentatonic Extending outwards and now this hidden pentatonic. So de and cla Deon plays with these two sides. And we can hear a passage of Deborah see as he orbits the moon essentially. I think that brings us nicely to hear. I sent out a survey ahead of this lecture about the chills, and I just wanna say a few things about it. Our time is running out. All those ever beam mechanisms can combine. You can feel sad about through one pathway, scared through another and um, delighted through a third. And that's why we have these profound effects. The chills is this experience at particular points of music that we love, where we get goosebumps and shiver down our spine. About half the population get them, but 90% of music students get them. So either that's exposure or I prefer to think of it the chills as the siren call to music professionalism or the people who responded to my survey. It was 96% by the way. Um, these are the pieces, uh, Beethoven came out on top, but Vaughn Williams had the, um, biggest, most requested pieces in the La Ascending and Fantasia on the theme of Thomas Tallis. Um, lot of rack Manano, pink Floyd's, dark side of the moon, all over the place. Um, but what is intriguing to me is the diversity. I couldn't put them all there. Only if they had two mentions I could put it up there. So there's this huge range, range on what I'm calling now the Schubert Slipknot continuum.<laugh>. These are the sort of responses that I've pulled out. There were hundreds and they sort of gravitate to these sort of themes. Catharsis sudden change, usually from low to high, a sense of anticipation builds communion, dissonance. These seemed quite, uh, at odds with each other, but they are surprisingly consistent in the literature. A resolution that's gives you what you want, but twists something. Why, why do we get the chills? Well, this theory is that we receive, we get chills temperature-wise when we're going from hot to cold or cold to hot. It seems odd, but that's what happens. But similarly, we get chills if we're in a safe place going to a, a unsafe place. Um, if we turn a corner and we're lost and we hear footsteps or if we think things are unsafe, like we're surprised at a birthday party and we think things are fine, that is if you like birthday parties and then you're happy at the end. And so what we find with music that gives us children is usually there's an opposition, a dissonance that suddenly releases or, um, most particularly this high frequency associated with Hammond Organ Church organ strings, vocals are usually associated. And this hypothesis is that's connected to the cry of a baby's voice. There's a particular register from two to four kilohertz that is alerting. If you're not heard of baby in a while, this this is what they sound like annoying, isn't it?<laugh>? Ah, they're fine. You hear that? So you want to attend to it, don't you? It's 'cause it's got this region here. And music gives us chills, seems to excite that we have to be alert to it. And as if suddenly finding or resolving the issue becomes this release and we get these chills. So here's some isolated vocals, Mary Clayton extraordinary back backing vocalist. And if you watch that square, you'll hear these squeaks right in that zone. Yay. Five minutes is great. Okay, so I'll just take one example and break it apart.'cause this came up a lot and it's one that happens to give me chills also. So I'll show you all the contrasting ways that it might create this chill moment. For example, eclipse comes right at the end of an album that is suggesting D Major, but never quite gets there. It hangs around in modal territory or in or in relative miners or in parallel miners or relative miners or those parallel minor. And um, and but finally we get to this D major. So there's a catharsis. There are these associations of being preached at.'cause you get the church organ and the soulful vocals. There's this twisted resolution where it hits the word sun and you think it's the end of the sentence, but it carries on. If you don't know this Jim, this might feel like nothing. But if you do, it'll feel like a lot, um, rhythmic entrainment. It's this waltzing six eight rhythm, but really strong binary landing point. So we're, and every time we go round the cycle, we bring in another vocalist and another vocalist to it builds and builds. And this communion. And communion, the chord sequence has two chords from the light side, two chords from the dark side of the moon. So we get those mysterious moments and it just turns and turns and turns. Um, hopefully it'll be impactful to some degree like this. Turn it up and I'll show you. I've tried to highlight some of these moments. So you came here to discover why music moves us. And I'll answer it as plainly as I can. Music moves us because it engages with our primal instincts to survive, to protect, to love, to defend, to predict. And so music engages with what we are as a species. Music also relies on this complex web of associations, musical, cultural, historic. And so it reflects where we are in culture and time. And finally, music engages with our own personal stories, your stories lives that will never be lived again while your lives loves dreams and pains. And so finally, music reflects who we are. Thank you so much. So I, I've, I've got a few questions which we've sort of this little button you might have seen on your screen where you could, um, that's where I got this. Yeah, you can get predict some frequencies. So the more common ones, I'll go first. Um, during your research for this, what was the most surprising or counterintuitive thing that you came across in trying to relate music to? Emotional, The baby's cry was a shock and obvious in re there's so many things that are obvious in retrospect. Um, what we take for granted about, um, musical structure and particularly the links with language. Um, I find that fascinating. Well, I read about 15 big books on this, so I've learned from all of them. But the, um, I think how it can be explained just by quite simple mechanisms of wanting to survive, it seems simplistic, but once the complexity of music comes in, it's a very convincing argument for the tapestry of motion that music can create. So, um, I think we've all experienced this. So you get a, a song that means a lot to you is meaningful in some way, but then turns into an earworm that you can't get. What, what, what happens When that's something Becomes a real drive that Peter wants? Well, I'd say geometric shapes and what else has geometric shapes? But Tetris, anyone who's played Tetris will know that that is get hooked as well. Music is also sequential. So if you ever rehearse music, it's very hard to do it from beat two and a half. You want to go from the beginning. So it's this process, this domino effect that happens. And so, um, once we hear it, we've gotta con we have to continue it. And um, so we're really working out the process and the sort of logic and it's really hard to let those go if they're intriguing or still puzzling. We're still working on them. You're still trying to get Mar Davis outta of your head just now. Yeah, I'll leave him in there though. Yeah. Um, this, this is a question which I think is quite important, is how, why does achingly sad music sometimes make you feel better if you are already sad? Oh, 'cause okay, that's a brilliant question is one slide that I didn't allow myself, but this is the interesting thing. Sometimes music, when you see a cooking program, they, this is going somewhere, I promise <laugh> they score as if you are, it's energetic and it's sad, so you make it angry music, it's sad and slow. So you kind of move these simple parameters. But the reality about music is that some of the most heartbreaking music is in a major key. And it's because you see music as a friend. I think, and I dunno if you ever lost some, some, but it's when someone's kind to you, that's when you cry. Why am I crying?<laugh>. But that's, and that's the fact and the reverse is true. It's you, someone is acknowledging how angry you feel. And so it feels so great to hear Shasta co string quartet number eight.'cause it's everything that you, you feel inside and someone is expressing it on your behalf. So, which brings us to why, um, composers construct musical cause. I mean, they're not presumably or they're not thinking of the technical reasons, but this is happening, but they do evoke certain spiritual experiences. So you know, somebody here says, well, think back to Gregorian ch it creates an atmosphere and emotional of it. So yet surprisingly simple music, how do you move from that to the more complex code? Without, without these we have to remember that, um, like I said, music reflects where we are. And listening to Gregorian charts 400 years ago is different from hearing them. Today we have this set of expectations. So distorted guitar used to sound distorted. Now it sounds wholly accessible. Tapping on two and four is completely normative, which was originally a syncopation perhaps. So, uh, composers are looking to please but also to surprise. And so as we go through history, we find these turns and it's not a linear thing easier. Usually we find great, um, innovations happening by reaching back in the past. Like leg Getty's Lux Turner is essentially renaissance writing with a chromatic language <laugh>. And so composers are always looking ways to reward listening but also delight and innovate. So, um, I'd like to see if we've got time to take one more question from the audience if anybody wants to put their hand up. We have a microphone. We've got one already. Fantastic. Hi. Um, uh, good evening. I was just wondering, um, are some people more moved by music than others? More moved. Moved, Did you say moved? Yeah. Yeah. Like does music affect some people more than other people? It's hard to gauge such things. I mean, clearly by just by reporting that seems to be the case. I do think that almost everyone has the capacity to be deep, to be deeply moved by music and we shouldn't associate certain composers with their capacity to move. Just like we all have the capacity to be heartbroken or fall in love or feel angered. I think we all have the capacity to find music that triggers those depths of emotion. Thank you. Um, I'd like once again, like to thank all of you for turning up to thank Milton for pushing up with some hiccups and what a triumph. And we look forward to your next one, Milton, thank you So much. Thank you.